cook_the_rude: (**Cubefall16 - female superior)
Dr. Hannibal Lecter ([personal profile] cook_the_rude) wrote in [community profile] ways_back_room2017-07-26 02:08 pm
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Wednesday DE: Rule 63

 What would your character be like gender-switched? Would there be much of a difference, both physically and in the societal setting of their world.
notallofus: (hera)

[personal profile] notallofus 2017-07-26 01:28 pm (UTC)(link)
Hera might have had a different relationship with her father, and made different choices because of it. A son might have more directly idolized his father, and in some vague headcanon, part of the reason Hera's father became so distant with her, especially after her mother's death, was because Hera reminded him of her mother. If Cham Syndulla's son had been closer to his father, and more dedicated to following in his footsteps, he may have stayed with him on Ryloth rather than leave to fight with the wider Rebellion.

Kanan would be basically the same to be honest.
just_cant_lose: (As Jack - Portfolio)

[personal profile] just_cant_lose 2017-07-26 01:33 pm (UTC)(link)
Not much difference. Jim might have had a bit more trouble being taken seriously as a woman, but the thing with being a criminal is that you can easily prove what a hardass you are. Plus, so few people have ever seen his face that it really doesn't matter.

Physically - well, yeah, a difference, but maybe not as much as with some other guys. Jim is surprisingly well-muscled for a guy that comes across as so slender. Reduce that as a woman and he'd be quite tiny. The same height, though. :D
bjornwilde: (01: Chance & George)

[personal profile] bjornwilde 2017-07-26 02:57 pm (UTC)(link)
I can't see much difference between male and female for Ahsoka. The Jedi don't seem to care much about gender roles.

Same with Sabine. I mean Mandalore seems to have more defined roles or expectations for gender roles but none that would effect Sabine's past.

Sam would likely have had a harder time training to be para-rescue and growing up as a black woman; if the things I read online about the challenges facing black women are anything to go by. Perhaps Samantha would be a harder person because of this, but I expect she'd still be a healer.

Chance's life would be much simpler to be honest. Her father would agree to train her to be his replacement for one thing, also other people are shown to listen more to men than women, so...

I don't much of a difference for Izana going either man or woman. They'd still be pretty much the same person.

Hank I think would be more anxious and nervous as Henrietta. Adding in the expected societal norms for women above blending in a mutant? I also worry she'd hide her intelligence, if not convince herself she wasn't worth the bother.

Danny as Daniel is interesting. I don't think any of the flash backs to K'un Lun showed women, but Madame Gao hints at coming from K'un Lun and it's hard to imagine any city being men only. Comics canon has shown a couple of woman Iron Fists as well, so I'm not sure what to think. I suspect at the least, Daniel might be less angry than Danny.
Edited 2017-07-26 14:58 (UTC)
iprotectyou: Baze smiling the tiniest bit (why hello there)

[personal profile] iprotectyou 2017-07-26 03:44 pm (UTC)(link)
Baze probably wouldn't be as big as he is, currently? Though he, as a woman, would probably still haul around her weapons and garner arthritic knees from doing parkour. She wouldn't have any children still, and would continue killing Imperials. So, not that much of a difference.
harryhotspur: (Default)

[personal profile] harryhotspur 2017-07-26 04:03 pm (UTC)(link)
A HUGE DIFFERENCE. SO MUCH DIFFERENCE.

Assuming ones personality is a little bit inherent and not all socially developed, Harry would be a very impatient, impudent gentlewoman who was probably the despair of her entire family. Her father would certainly have tried to get her married to Hal or one of his brothers, and failing that, she would probably be married to Edmund Mortimer (real Harry's brother-in-law). She probably wouldn't have developed the intense disdain for all this genteel that Harry has-- but then again, maybe she would. She probably would still have no particular aptitude for any of them.
inlovewithwords: Milliways roster: Lois Lane (teen, Gwenda Bond books); Tavi (Codex Alera); Anakin Skywalker/Darth Vader and R2-D2 (Star Wars); Evelyn Trevelyan (Dragon Age: Inquisition); Eriond (Belgariad/Mallorean) (Milliways roster 2017)

[personal profile] inlovewithwords 2017-07-26 04:31 pm (UTC)(link)
Eriond would not have been written that way/existed because David Eddings could not actually conceive of a non-bratty all-powerful goddess would really just be himself, his gender is kind of not important, although he doesn't quite skirt agender.

Evelyn is just an iteration of possible Inquisitors! There's some weird gender stuff in Thedas, some Standard Sexist Differences and a lot of them being absent. Meh, just play the game with a male mage Inquisitor. The only major chances are who the Inquisitor can romance. Honestly, more changes come from species or fighting class (cough NOT A MAGE cough) choices than gender.

Lois would be radically different as a boy, because one of her huge things is overcoming sexism in journalism. Also, her relationship with her dad would be way different. Male!Lois would probably not be the tallest guy around, if not short--5'10"?--but definitely keep the violet eyes. Because.

R2-D2 self-identifies (and is identified by others) as he, but honestly, droids more or less choose. Astromechs and non-droid-only speakers/non-humanoid droids of various kinds especially. Not really an issue. Except that in no universe would Lucas have identified him as female.

Anakin would totally not have, like, existed because I cannot actually imagine George Lucas giving that role in both PT and OT and the greater universe to a woman, let's face it, You Know It To Be True would not have been treated differently under the Jedi or Palpatine. The big things that aren't plot would be not getting StupidFace McWhinyPants for a PT actor--so maybe, Iunno, getting in some good acting?--or James Earl Jones for OT voice, which admittedly would kind of be a tragedy. OTOH, the enormous change is plot. Lots of decisions to be made about the Skywalker Twins at that point. And I am not going to figure it out now.

Tavi has made me write an essay and I apologize deeply. Tavi would physically not be much different, I think, except in that girl!Tavi would probably top out at around 6' even rather than, like, 6'4"-6'6"ish. Look, that family is ridiculously tall. Hilariously, girl!Tavi's name is still Tavi, because Octavia. Plot and societal are deeply wrapped up in each other, heavily rooted in the question of inheriting the Crown. If Kitai is not genderbent and they are Awesome Lesbians there is an impending problem of "No, Alera cannot realistically do all of recover from apocalypse, integrate two or three new species, end slavery, totally change societal structure, handle a woman for emperor, and transition to a sustainable republic all in Tavi's lifetime, and actually survive the next two centuries if there's a monogamous relationship that cannot produce children, because everyone will each each other--sometimes literally--and then get eaten by Vord--literally." And Tavi is never one for marriage-for-show or, like, have a kid just because? So at that point there are several fires waiting, if Kitai's not also genderbent. Super interesting to think about, but FIRES.

Related question of inheritance: Alera has never had a woman for an emperor! That's an enormous battle in and of itself. Even legitimate, strong legal arguments could be made about female!Tavi being ineligible to inherit. Sextus, who is a massive conservative in a lot of ways, has to make a decision about whether or not to "let" (ahahahaha 'let' like he could stop Tavi ever) Tavi inherit. Sextus' sexism is really interesting. It isn't that he doesn't think a woman could handle the job or even that "but women don't do that" because he is well aware that they do, in fact, do. His conservatism in general has more to do with his view that smashing through societal rules like that is likely to destabilize everything. If you can achieve progress without breaking the Realm, good, go do it, but otherwise, please just don't.

So he'd have a lot of doubts about Tavi inheriting over that, and about not wanting to see Tavi even more targeted for assassination (... though honestly, I am not sure that is possible), and Sextus really doesn't want his only grandchild dead. Once Tavi made the play for the Crown Sextus would absolutely be behind that, as much as he would if Tavi hadn't actually been legitimate, but he'd be reluctant to go there--whereas in canon he was just reluctant to until Tavi had his full furycrafting in and was absolutely training him for the Crown.

Plot-wise, books three and four go totally out the window and we end up with really weird situations, because women at that point in Alera so could not be Legion captains or even officers unless you were a High Lady playing political games and trying to steal the Legion for your treasonous lunatic brother. So at that point who even knows, because Tavi's Legion is crucial to, er, saving the world. Isana would probably still have stifled Tavi's furycrafting, because still looks like Septimus and that much furycrafting is still Identifiable, but who knows.

And then, well, Alera treats its women pretty terribly in general. Tavi's personality? Basically unchanged. Still brilliant, still a bit nuts, still mad scientist/engineer/archaeologist, still spy, still charismatic--except there's the huge barrier of Being A Woman. You thought canon Tavi was driven? Fffft oh god. I would run screaming from the sheer willpower girl!Tavi would need.
bjornwilde: (01: Sabine)

[personal profile] bjornwilde 2017-07-26 04:57 pm (UTC)(link)
OK, going meta and based on your point about SW favoring the male protagonist has me wondering how much more Ahsoka and Sabine would be in the narrative. At the least they'd likely be in more media and have more toys.

Like would Sabine dominate the stories of SWR as Ezra does?
i_am_your_host: (cubefall)

[personal profile] i_am_your_host 2017-07-26 05:42 pm (UTC)(link)
The Master of Ceremonies has been played by women in off-Broadway productions (most notably Amanda Palmer; and I love seeing casting calls that say the role is open to both men and women), so within the show itself it doesn't really matter. But in a bigger, historical setting? I'd say a female Emcee would be more of a novelty, and thus actually more popular. At least, for a while. She might be able to get away with just as much or more both on and offstage. But she would have far less privilege than a man, with more of a stigma placed on her for being a nightclub performer and a prostitute.

Pam's human life would be totally different. Instead of her aristocratic parents wanting to marry her off to the richest suitor, male Pam would be the suitor. I don't know if he would think as badly of these social constraints, but he would probably break away from the family at some point. Victorian men certainly had more rights than women and he wouldn't have had to struggle to assert himself. He probably wouldn't have run a brothel? But maybe? Because he wanted to provide a safe working environment for prostitutes? He wouldn't have caught Eric's eye--but if Eric were a woman, well, there's a tale to be told there. I think their roles as Maker and Progeny would be exactly the same, and I kind of love the idea of male Pam being a well-kept Ken doll.

Floki as a woman just makes me wish his daughter grew up so she could be an awesome mix of her parents, a bit hippie witch and a bit brainy builder. Which I think Floki would have been if he were a woman. Viking society still had its gender roles firmly in place, but I'm sure there was still room for non-conformists. A female Floki would have insisted on learning from her father how to build ships, though she would have also learned how to manage a home. But as she grows older and never marries, she dedicates more time to her craft. Her friendship with Ragnar would probably be the same!

Female Cassidy just makes me laugh. Because you know we all have that one girlfriend.
idontneedluck: (I believe I can fly)

[personal profile] idontneedluck 2017-07-26 07:55 pm (UTC)(link)
Chirrut's life probably wouldn't have changed that much, other than probably getting into a few more fights after the temple fell because until taught otherwise, a lean blind woman with a stick is less scary than a lean blind man with a stick to some people.

Protip: Still scary and can kick you in the face.
childofrebellion: (dancing with Jyn)

[personal profile] childofrebellion 2017-07-26 08:13 pm (UTC)(link)
This is an interesting question.

Cassian I don't think would be that different, honestly it would be a better gender balance in the Rogue One crew. A lot of how his character works in someways would fit better with a woman, blending in, the huge amount of self control, not allowing his anger to show and would make a great contrast with Jyn. So instead of seeing two different ways of rebelling and being broken by the Empire, its also two ways of being a woman who fights in the world of Star Wars.

Charles would be hugely different since a woman in that era would be pushed in a completely other path. Instead of being welcomed into the academic world, she'd have to fight for everything and while her privilege from money would help, I think she'd end up more like Rosalind Franklin.

Quentin, I think would be slightly different but not hugely. Fae society is more concerned with what race you are and your nobility than your gender. I think Toby would probably trust a her quicker than him.

William wouldn't have the same story at all, because of the gender roles of the era. On the frontier, things are a little easier but there wouldn't be the sense of needing to be in her father's shoes.

Sameth would I think both be easier in some ways and harder in others. The Old Kingdom is gender neutral in terms of power, its more can you do the job. The harder part would be going to the same school as Ellimere, I think it helps Sam a lot to be at Somersby not Wyverly, because he has space to figure himself out. If they were at the same school, his sense of not being good enough would be much more.

Moist would use different tricks to get to people, I imagine he'd be more like Sophie from Leverage.

Will S. would have a completely different story and probably never be connected with Robin.

Ivan also would have a very different life and probably be arranged to be married to Miles which would alter the dynamic of their relationship.

Demeter wouldn't work as a man, she's one of the most feminine of goddesses.

Tumnus, I don't actually know if there are female Fauns.
Edited 2017-07-26 20:13 (UTC)
andinfluencepeople: (Default)

[personal profile] andinfluencepeople 2017-07-26 08:42 pm (UTC)(link)
FWIW, Miles is horrified. I approve.
childofrebellion: (laugh)

[personal profile] childofrebellion 2017-07-26 08:47 pm (UTC)(link)
Heh, its exactly what the Vor would do. I think Ivan wouldn't like it either and they'd both try to find ways around it. I can imagine lots of introductions of oh that's my cousin, fiancee, ignore them.
arkadia: (Default)

[personal profile] arkadia 2017-07-26 09:03 pm (UTC)(link)
For Eden and Hawke, basically nothing would change. The most you can really say is that it slightly changes Hawke's dynamic with Carver (if that one letter in DA2 is anything to go by), but the lion's share of Carver's issues with Hawke come from them being a mage and the eldest.

For Yamato, it -- depends. If things pan out as they do in canon, and Hiroaki and Natsuko still have Yamato choose who stays with Natsuko and who stays with Hiroaki, she'd turn out basically the same, if maybe slightly gruffer.

The bigger change would be how it affects her dynamic with the other Chosen: Her relationship with Taichi would be a lot less combative in the literal punching stuff sense, just because while she'd be up for fighting him, he probably wouldn't be up for fighting her -- but they'd still argue just as much. Similarly, instead of being jealous of Taichi and being worried that he'll usurp him as Takeru's brother, she'd probably be jealous of Sora and worried that she'll usurp her as Takeru's sister -- and that'd probably get sorted out a lot quicker, because Sora's both more perceptive and more willing to confront her problems head on than Taichi is, so there'd be a very frank discussion about it pretty early on.

Also, she'd be a lot closer to Mimi, if only because it's probably Mimi's personal mission in life to be the best friend of every shy girl she encounters.

But it's just as likely that instead of Hiroaki and Natsuko asking Yamato choose who her parent should be, they'd just go 'well, Natsuko should raise Yamato, since she's a girl, and Hiroaki should raise Takeru, since he's a boy,' in which case it's difficult to know how Yamato would have turned out: Natsuko is a much more attentive parent than Hiroaki is, so chances are she'd end up with much less pronounced abandonment issues, at the very least.
aberration: Pabu from LoK taking a nap next to an old-fashioned radio. (kashira kashira)

[personal profile] aberration 2017-07-26 11:02 pm (UTC)(link)
Will - While they're different characters, I do kind of get the impression that in the original Thomas Harris books, Clarice was kind of a second run at Will, but as a woman. They have somewhat similar backgrounds, having grown up in poverty in rural areas of the U.S., and in the books fill essentially the same role as the audience-POV voice to look at Hannibal Lecter. Clarice allowed Harris to explore issues of sexism and misogyny, in law enforcement and just in general, which I think might be why he decided to have a woman protagonist for SotL. The main difference is that book!Will Graham is experienced-weary (and Lecter really just straight up hates him and wants him to be miserable), and Clarice is a novice (and Lecter doesn't hate her, though I don't really recall the same obsessive affection he gets toward her until the third book). Which... I guess my point is that in the context of the original books, Clarice can be kind of seen as the genderflipped Will Graham, in that they come from similar backgrounds and explore a lot of similar things, but Clarice's gender also gives the story an additional dimension. The show reimagines the character pretty significantly, but it also adapts a lot of the Clarice storylines into Will's, so... [shrug emoji] I think I had a point somewhere.

Aside from that, though, from how I play him – basically if Will were perceived as a woman, she would be a woman most of the time. But he's usually not so he usually isn't. I'd wonder if a woman with an empathy disorder would get the same kind of 'misunderstood loner genius' treatment that Will does, at least from the FBI, which could have a lot of different ramifications for better or worse, but. As a person I don't think she would change much.


Asami - A man in Asami's place might have dealt with different expectations, especially regarding behavior and appearance. He might not have Asami's tendencies to be very polite and agreeable when possible, and may have been immediately taken seriously in situations where Asami would have had to work a little more for that. I don't necessarily think that means he would have been impolite/disagreeable/etc., but might not be as cautious and thoughtful as Asami tries to be.
not_my_sandbox: Steph Brown and the ridiculous half-baked Batman AU! (Steph Brown)

[personal profile] not_my_sandbox 2017-07-27 01:30 am (UTC)(link)
For Amascut, very little would change. There's the fact that she is a god anyhow, so gender is just a thing. Well, less of a thing. Plus, she chooses to look human and a lot of the intelligent species in her canon don't have strict gender roles, humans very much included. Women serve in all militaries and can be just as murderous or vile or heroic as men.

Well, there was a faction of Zamorakians(CHAOSCHAOSCHAOS) who were extremely anti-woman that eventually got one of their own into the top echelons of Zamorakian military, but he got killed in an ill-advised war and the fraction of his faction that survived was mostly purged with extreme prejudice by a particularly sadistic witch.

Well, I guess that is one role that is strictly female. I haven't seen a male witch ingame.

Anyhow, Amascut might be more closely modeled on Set(h) and Apep rather than Sekhmet and Ammit if she were male. I might have also picked Seth Green as a PB (because of redheaded Set clone LOL)

Fairy Fixit though... There's something major going unspoken about gender roles in Zanarian Fairy society. After the Fairy Mafia is defeated, no male fairies are ever seen in the game again. And even before that, only three are visible; the Fairy Godfather, Slim Louie, and Fat Rocco. Since it is now canon that Zanarian Fairy "species" may have arisen from a symbiosis of a highly intelligent Cordyceps-like fungus and a highly industrious social insect, it may just be that males are rare. And maybe unhappy about their lot in life. And now, strictly controlled lest they gain enough power to attempt a coup again.

Fairy Fixit would probably be a troublemaker and a more generalist tinkerer if she were male. The coup may have succeeded, or at least it would have been harder to defeat, if Fairy Fixit were genderswapped. The anti-Mafia Resistance would have been hurting a great deal more without her covert help, anyhow.