(no subject)

[milliways-mods.livejournal.com]

We could use some assistance.

We have received an application from someone wishing to play God in Milliway's. This character could have a huge impact on characters and story lines already in progress, so we think the best idea is to ask for a general consensus on whether or not this is a good plan. Your opinions would be greatly appreciated. Potential-God-mun, please join in, we'd love to hear your thoughts.

Please take the time to comment, because after the decision has been made there's no changing it, and we will kindly draw your attention to this post should complaints be made. We're nice like that.

ETA: God-mun has bowed out. Comments on this entry are now closed.

Comments

(frozen comment)

[true_desire]

... Wow. That's rather big.
Which book/movie/what have you...?

(frozen comment)

[a-fell.livejournal.com]

The Bible.

(frozen comment)

[leplusbeau]

...um. I feel odd with having God running about. Like the God. I mean, He could just say "Fleur, no more" and no more Fleur. I think that might be a little too all powerful for us. I don't know. I don't want to join anyone's fun. But that's my thought.

(frozen comment)

[and-eggs.livejournal.com]

which God?

no, really. there's a lot of conflicting canons out there. old testament? new testament? apocrypha? book of mormon? qur'an? kevin smith's dogma? milton? donne? nietzsche?

it's not the character that i can see having an impact on large numbers of characters as much as the mere existence of the character. like majikthies and vroomfondel said, after all, what's the use of sitting up all night arguing that there may or may not be a God, if the computer comes along and gives you his bleeding phone number? :-)

which isn't a vote No, but it's a vote for caution, and a plea for flexibility in the event that the God character does join the bar. would non-believing characters be permitted to just not see him there, for example?

(frozen comment)

[mogget_cat]

Dude, Dogma's God wouldn't be able to talk. We'd have to get Metatron back in here.

(frozen comment)

[mogget_cat]

I will be happy to watch and join in with the really awkward situations between God and all the characters. Quite a few of them won't be at their ease with someone who knows their every thought before they think it.

Hopefully, the future God-mun is well-versed in many of the fandoms, as omnipotence would be hard to pull off if there are 'worlds' the mun doesn't know.

Would God-mun be playing as the Landlord?

/two cents

(frozen comment)

[bloody-awful.livejournal.com]

I think it raises too many sticky situations ... I mean, which deity are we talking about? Old-Testament Yahweh, New Testament Jehovah, the Allah of the Koran? And there's the question for those muns and characters don't believe in those entities. Does your Jehovah trump my Odin? Do all the angels have to worship him? How much power would such a character have?

I hate to say "I don't want to play with you" to anyone... but I really don't think this would be appropriate.

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[yesthatgod.livejournal.com]

I would not try to "Trump" your character or your own beliefs. I would simply be around. Like Death.

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[dredpiratejenny.livejournal.com]

I think it would be important to know the flexibility/religious tolerance of the person playing God. Not their beliefs, but how they view God as working in the hierarchy of characters.

Exempli gratis: Odysseus, for one, has no concept of a single omnipotent deity, and the presence of a Judeo-Christian God who insists that he is more powerful than the Greek pantheon would really fuck with his canon, if you know what I mean. However, if God-mun views his or herself as co-existing with a number of deities (I'm thinking along the lines of American Gods, Sandman, a number of canons where all religious beings are thrown together in one mishmash, yet are seen to be totally valid in their, well, deificity).

And I suppose as stands true for playing any character around here, a hefty sense of humor would be required, because things will get wacky. What with the direct contradiction of many canons caused by God.

That said, I think it could potentially be hilarious. With the right attitude. And the right amount of religio-historical knowledge. I'll probably think of more comments later, but that's my two cents for now.

(frozen comment)

[clumsy_auror]

Hmmmm. Well, I suppose there are multiple ways it could be played...a lighthearted, snarks-at-everyone-knowingly God would be great, but I dunno. I mean, the A/C plot, for example, would clearly be impacted by that. Then again...the Morningstar's in the bar, already, so...

Well. Am clearly conflicted. I guess my knee-jerk reaction would be similar to Fleur-mun's, in that I'm not keen on someone else having the unlimited ability to, literally, god Tonks around the bar. But I'm also open to discussion.

(frozen comment)

[muddypetticoats.livejournal.com]

Except that even the Morningstar isn't at the same level of power as God. He's the ruler of Hell, sure, but he was one of God's minions first. He's powerful, but he's not the Creator. God still trumps even him.

Of course, I haven't finished Good Omens, so I could be entirely missing the point of that canon. Who knows?

(frozen comment)

[muddypetticoats.livejournal.com]

Second what Hamlet-mun had to say regarding the matter, although I think my vote leans more towards an outright 'no'. That's just too damn powerful, and the idea makes me very uncomfortable. It's not so much that I think the character will twink out (although it could, and in a very BIG way), as that the character simply being present will have some serious repercussions. And those potential repercussions, make me squirm. My apologies to the potential mun, but I can't support the idea.

(frozen comment) My Two Cents

[go-between.livejournal.com]

I think it will largely depend upon the player. It could be really fun, or really horrifically abused. Since the mods (presumeably) know the player, they should probably make the choice. If they don't know the player that well, they should ask people who do.

Also, this player should probably have previous RPG experience.

Okay, I'll shut it and be happy now.

^_^

(frozen comment)

[capt_angie]

Isn't God just a little bit too all powerfull? I know that lots of people have powers of different kinds but God would have INFINATE power. Whatever he says would have to go basically.

Also something for the potential God-mun to think about is that God is all seeing all knowing. I'm also Drusilla from Buffy so i kind of know how hard this can be to play when i come across fandoms I don't know. I can get away with Dru not knowing everything about everyone because of her insanity and saying things like 'the stars don't talk at the end of the universe' but God will have no such excuses.

(frozen comment)

[yesthatgod.livejournal.com]

Hello all,

This is God-mun. I want to establish here and now, that I plan in NO WAY to step on anyones plots or make them not exist. I want to do this merely for entertainment; Like God popping in and having a conversation with Lucifer. I would be a very laid-back God. I don't plan to make people not exist, as then I would be ruining yours, and my fun. I am not really religious at all, so I wouldn't be going around accusing people of this and that.

As for which God I am, I figured it was the same way you can look at Death. She is The Death, but there are many aspects of her. That is my idea. That I am just one aspect of God.

So I hope you will allow it, all I want is to come in and have fun, just like all of you. No toe/wing/gill stepping. I promise. If I do something bad, ya'll can throw my ass out.

I will be on my best behavior.

(frozen comment)

[fairest1.livejournal.com]

So, will you be playing it in the sense of hey-Dionysus-how's-it-going, below-Endless as far as ranks go, shrug off the A/C relationship like Lucifer did(eventually) and try not to fuck around with us too much?

Also, you'd better be well-versed in the majority of players' cannon.

(frozen comment)

[lord-of-dreams.livejournal.com]

No.

My reasons were discussed with Sophie already.

(frozen comment)

[aj_crawley]

Chuck 'em in here? This is a forum for opinions, after all.

(frozen comment)

[fairest1.livejournal.com]

Hmmm. Tough call. We had that guy who wanted to RP Jesus, friended everyone, and never showed up . . . We've got a few characters who could be viewed as the second coming or the antichrist, and Aslan . . . Is this mun prepared to have to know every player's fandom and put up with the questions that would immediately come to mind for the characters when placed in such a situation?

(frozen comment)

[minkhollow]

...It depends.
I mean, on the one hand, we've already got someone RPing Jesus (though he has yet to enter the bar), not to mention Lucifer and Dionysus. But on the other hand... not sure how to put this into words... you might lose either way you do the characterization.
The icon I'm using at present is from a set of stories a friend online wrote; that particular version of God would be quite interesting to see, as would other nontraditional thingies. But then you'd get people all upset because it 'wasn't right.' Likewise, if you stick with the common concept of God, you'll get people going 'ACK BLASPHEMERS!'
Given the fact that we've already got a few characters on a similar level in, it makes saying no look kinda silly. But I'm not sure it'd be worth the trouble to the game or the RPer to OK it.

(frozen comment)

[weallscream.livejournal.com]

I've got to say I just don't see how it could be anything but a huge fight. Where my characters would be obliterated, evil SOB's that they are. It's one thing to punch Santa, but God...

(frozen comment)

[anthy-rosebride.livejournal.com]

*sort of squicked, somehow*

Maybe I will say something more useful later tonight?

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[darthrami.livejournal.com]

I have to say, as absolutely hesitant as I am to say no to somebody, I think that having God around would be a Bad Idea for many of the reasons already mentioned above. :-/

(frozen comment)

[missginnytonic.livejournal.com]

Well. I am thinking that is a Sticky thing.. and there are many reason's as to why there shouldn't be a God here.. I think the easiest way to deside is have the God-Mun do a demo post and see how it goes over.

(frozen comment)

[sign-seeker.livejournal.com]

Hmm.

On the one hand, I'm rather reluctant to say "no" to any decent RPer wanting to play a character.

On the other hand... well, heaven knows we have lots of hugely varying power levels in this bar, but God is omnipotent and omniscient. (With some caveats and limitations depending on your particular brand of theology.) That's huge. That trumps everybody in the bar, put together. And that worries me a bit. That's a mighty big power imbalance there.

Also, it impinges on a lot of plotlines, as you say, and a lot of canons. And then there are canons with no conception of God, or canons in which God is a fiction or less immortal/enduring than an Endless. Not to mention the fact that God has been hinted to be the Landlord, who's always absentee.

On the whole, I think I'm leaning towards no, though I'm willing to be persuaded or overruled. Not that there wouldn't be some fun stuff, with the right version of God in the right player's hands, but just by His very nature, an Abrahamic God would throw a lot of characters and plotlines off in ways that might not be retrievable. I'm all for throwing a monkey wrench into the works now and then, but I'm worried that this would end up being the power switch instead for some characters/plots.

(frozen comment)

[go-between.livejournal.com]

If it has been hinted that the Landlord might be God, then perhaps the God-Mun could play the Landlord instead. Then it's all nice and vague and unprovable in a hint-hint, wink-wink, Dumbledore-twinkle sort of way.

^_^

(frozen comment)

[pjpettigrew.livejournal.com]

Please veto God as a character.

God doesn't have a fandom. The books of the Bible are the basis of three religions, not a fandom.

Furthermore, let's face it--from the point of view of literature, God is a lousy part. The Endless are flawed. Lucifer is flawed. God is supposed to be omnipotent and omniscient...and no one will ever be able to oppose it. Ever. Conflict is impossible. Growth and development of character are impossible. The character is too powerful, and would be far, far, far too open to horrific abuse. As a part, it's a Hostess Twinkie the size of a galaxy.

And let's not even get into the wankage which would start over the Bible being declared fiction.

Also, due to the fact that no one really knows what God is like, and that different translations of the Bible depict God in different lights, the character of God would be, for all practical purposes, an Original Character.

Original characters are not allowed at Milliways.

And original characters that have vast amounts of power--didn't this issue already arise with the fake Destruction? I thought it did.

For these reasons--NO. Absolutely not. Under no circumstances.

(frozen comment)

[puckishly.livejournal.com]

Well, I believe Aziraphale-mun said that God counts as public domain. Like Santa, and various other iconic beings.

I think that as far as conflicting beliefs and such go, you're right. I also agree about God being a lame character in the omnipotent-omnipresent-omniscient sense. It'd probably be a lot easier to play Dogma!God (or maybe Monty Python!God). What if God-mun were to settle for playing God from a distinct fandom? Then there'd be definite character guidelines, and it'd all be much less nebulous (about whether the Bible is fictional, and other such disputes).

(Not that I claim to speak for you, God-mun. I'd just like to know how other people would feel about the idea if it were tweaked a little.)

(frozen comment)

[dramaturgca.livejournal.com]

I have to say I'm not thrilled with the idea. There have already been minor "rank" issues here and having a God would only make things more complicated. It just seems like we're asking for trouble.
I think it would be fascinating to have a Creator character, but I think that the demand on the mun would be too great. How, other than a pact we all entered into, would we avoid characters walking up and demanding to know why the bad things in their lives happened? Also, most normal humans are unsure of the existence or non-existence of God, depending on their faiths. People fight wars about God. Are we willing to introduce an element that permanently answers that question?
I, too, absolutely hate to deny anyone the opportunity to play here, and I think it's an interesting character chioce, but I don't think it's a good idea.

(frozen comment)

[yesthatgod.livejournal.com]

What if we made it a God from a specific fandom? Like the God in Dogma or something to that effect? (although I would prefer not to look like Alanis Morisete)

(frozen comment)

[i_vanquish_evil]

Gonna say, that I'm not entirely thrilled by the idea. I'm not religious, don't follow one specific religion, however, I can see how this might turn into an uncomfortable situation for anyone.

Also, I agree with Peter-mun's views that since no one really knows what God is like, that sort of makes God an OC.

And I can see it causing issues with some characters. VH for one - as he is 'employed' by the church and is a (if I've read into the lines correctly) fallen angel w/ no memory of such - kinda mucks up his canon to know there's a guy who can give it all back - he'll kind of have no reason to do his job anymore. (And he's got enough angst.)

My vote isn't 'absolutely not'; more of a 'I find the idea a little squicky and would rather avoid the potential problems'.

(frozen comment)

[blue_ajah]

Well. This is rather thought-provoking, actually. *tosses in much more than two-cents' worth.*

From an RP standpoint (and this is in no way making any assumptions about the skill level of the potential mun, btw), I'd be really hesitant to allow it, for the simple reason that we're talking about the omnipotent. I had always sort of assumed that in the structure of Milliways, the omnipotent being in question was the Landlord; allowing God as Deity in the bar sort of trumps the existing structure of the entire place and game, I think. It's essentially giving control over ALL plots to one player. The potential for disaster is rather large. (Same goes for any omnipotent deity, from any religious belief system. Particular key word there is omnipotent, if you haven't picked up on that already.) No matter how responsible and good a player might be, the fact is that it's just one view, and would be one view that could override everyone else in the game... whether intended or not, it would eventually happen, in one case or another.

From a religious viewpoint, I'm still hesitant. :) (For the record, I am Episcopalian; I came to this path after over a decade of searching and studying different systems of belief, in varying degrees.) I am very unnerved by the idea of someone professing to represent Deity in such a way; I'd feel the same whether the player were devoutly religous or not, because I think that Deity is something too vast to be represented and bounded by the opinion of any individual. (And again, same goes for whatever Name you choose to call upon, in whatever religious belief system you prefer.)

Really, no offense to the potential mun, but I truly, truly believe this is not a good thing to allow, nor would it be a good precedent to set. I don't want to see Milliways become a stomping ground for religious debate -- I can imagine a situation where, if this character were approved, there would be other applications made for other Deity aspects from other religious belief systems, and then a truly disastrous encounter could emerge. Would emerge.

Leave the Landlord in absentia as the "Creator" (generic) for the game, and let everyone choose the image and Name that best suits them, and we'll all go one with our limited (in some way or another) characters in a lovely RPG. Please.

(frozen comment)

[primroseburrows.livejournal.com]

I think that the character should be allowed, based on the rules of the game. Any fictionalised character, right? God certainly has been fictionalised overandover.

I'm as apprehensive as hell, but if the game is to stick to its rules, then either God should be allowed as a character, or the rules should be changed.

(frozen comment)

[miscellanny.livejournal.com]

It's cool, yes, to have a fictionalised character. However, the mun would have to agree to *be* that fictionalised character, with any limitations of *that* *canon*. For instance; Dogma God cannot speak to humans. Fandom-god would be more acceptable than God. If that makes sense.

(frozen comment)

[pat-trick.livejournal.com]

First question: God from which idea of God? Christian? Old Testament? etc?

Second question: How much power does God retain? Overarching? Or is he beholden (no pun intended holden) to the laws / rules of exsistence within Milliways?

My only worry is that someone might abuse the Godliness if they were given it, especially if other characters do not believe in God or worship another diety; would God have any power over those characters?

Just a few observations. Other than that, go for it.