ways_back_room | DE: I'll show you mine if you show me yours

Let's see with Will, I pick and choose between the myriad of versions of Robin Hood. If I wanted to introduce them to why I love Will, I would link to Chapter 23 of Paul Creswick's Robin Hood as his Stuteley combined with N C Wyeth's illustrations, because they're how I first fell in love with the story. Then I'd recommend watching Disney's Robin Hood, Errol Flynn's Robin Hood and carefully sampling the various other versions out there.

With Charles, I'm in that position of being sort of new to the fandom and I love the movieverse of the X-Men quite a lot. I would recommend not watching the third movie and be wary of the Wolverine movie but recommend the others. A great marathon would be XMFC-X-Men-X2. The comics are huge and sprawling and someone else can recommend them better as I've only dipped my toes in a bit and there's just so much history.

Sameth's canon is one I discovered because of Milliways and it has issues with pacing and characterization. Yet it was one that another Milliways' player went read this and I went okay and ended up with a character, best recommendation I know.

Discworld is huge and sprawling, I recommend starting with the Watch or Witches' books then going to the Tiffany Aching books. Moist's books don't make that much sense without the context of the Watch books The Death books need to be read in order starting with Mort. Small Gods and Pyramids are wonderful stand alone novels. I happen to enjoy the Wizard books, but they're some of Pratchett's more uneven works.

3:10 to Yuma is a great movie, go watch it. Then go read Elmore Leonard's short story while listening to the fantastic soundtrack.

Greek Mythology has tons of variations before you hit the modern world. One of the best resources for it is theoi.com, which can lead you to the original sources of many myths. In terms of adaptations, this is a tricky question because it depends what you like; plays, epics, poetry. Demeter doesn't figure in a lot of modern adaptations, Persephone does far more often.

Becoming Jane is a beautiful movie and I recommend it if you enjoyed Shakespeare in Love and like Jane Austen. Its the same type of story just with a different author. Then I'd recommend reading Jane Austen's works, she's one of my favorite authors. If you're wary of a book that might be too heavy, start with Northanger Abbey as it pokes fun at many Gothic tropes.

Narnia has had many gorgeous adaptations and publications. Start with the books, then see the newer movies and then the BBC adaptation which is the first one I saw.

The Pirates of Penzance is wonderful. I recommend the 1983 movie version with Kevin Kline and Angela Lansbury as that's what inspired the version I play. I highly recommend reading the play, because Gilbert and Sullivan really have to be read to appreciate all the word play.

There are plenty of bits of Felix's canon that aren't relevant to him specifically. Quite a lot of the first game, for instance. Also there's a lot I don't like about Dark Dawn, the third part that came out a couple of years ago, but as that contradicts pre-existing millicanon I don't have to come up with a reason to disregard it.

As for attracting people, I daresay there are a few videos that might do the trick. (Protip: Don't have all of those playing at once; except for the last one they've got the same background music, and unless you get them perfectly synchronized (which is not necessarily even possible, as they're compliations of cut bits) it can get overwhelming and conflicty.) Also just about all the music.

For Kain, I completely disregard anything and everything in "After Years" (and whatever sequel/prequel/whatever may have been made since), mostly because I haven't ever had opportunity to play it.

As far as Fluttershy (and Cranky), there are a couple of problematic episodes. 1x15 "Feeling Pinkie Keen" and 2x08 "The Mysterious Mare-Do-Well" stand out in that regard. (Some people have a particular dislike for the writer of the latter, but I have no significant problem with her other episodes.)

Now, pony encouragement, going only by canon...One, two, buckle my... um...
Maybe I should start over?

A few weeks ago Rami let me know that Mark of 'Mark Reads Stuff' fame is currently reading the Alanna books. (He is also reading Feed,

cantkill_truth's canon!) His chapter by chapter reviews have pretty much made my LIFE. Not only has he been reacting to the good the way I did as a kid while pointing out how much these books would have meant to him at that age, he's also brought up the bits that bother me: for instance, the Bazhir.

I am SO looking forward to his take on book two, since that's where I've got

the_lioness now. :DDD

headed4hell's canon made me SO MAD in the series finale. Well, before that too, due to their treatment of Neely. (Seriously, show? Seriously???) BUT. I felt like they had handled everything to do with the bombing fairly well until that point -- as respectfully as they could while making it a major plot point, I guess. And then they did that THING, with the THING, and UGH. I got really angry about that. (Spoilers can be found here. See the paragraph that starts 'Ok. Here's what happened.')

As for promoting the totally awesome, I think this vid captures Grace's energy really well: But it's vaguely spoilery and NSFW!

For

snowy_river_man, I always point people at the last ten minutes or so of the movie: his ride will never not be completely AMAZING. I am both eager and nervous to write it.

There are of course major plot holes and inconsistencies in PotC canon, but I tend to ignore all that in favor of making people watch Lizzie and Will getting married by Barbossa in the middle of a battle. Because, yes. :D

Well, there is, of course, the whole issue with ReBoot season 4. We skipped the second half of that (except for a few useful bits) in Millicanon, but in terms of pure fandom, I don't actually ignore that arc, I just wish it had been done much, much better. I do, on the other hand, prefer to gently ignore the two "Identity Crisis" episodes (end of season 1), because while they're actually pretty cool, they directly contradict established rules of that universe. (Namely, Phong appears to be able to look into and then enter a Game in progress. The rest of the series makes it very clear that you can't do that.)

It's hard for me to answer the second part, because I am very much a start-at-the-beginning person, so that is what I would show newbies, even though the best stuff doesn't happen until the third season.

There are people out there who find Villains By Necessity to be too heavy-handed, but I am not one of them. In general I find it an amazing book worth reading; one of my favorite bits goes into what the main party's dreaming about (oh, Valerie).

Warehouse 13... well. They have a bad tendency of killing or (temporarily, anyway) making the non-straight characters evil, even if in both cases they have gotten better; the geography fail bugs the shit out of me;* I take so much issue with where HG's arc went in S2 that I'm planning to AU around it; I have no idea what to do with the S3 finale, which would make half of S4 unplayable (I do feel better about that stupid metronome now, though); prior to this season they haven't used Leena nearly enough; and oh yeah THEY WHITEWASHED HG. Sorry, I can't get past that. Cata and Sam won't let me.
As for recommendations, I love it on the whole and it's one of those rare shows where you can actually recommend the pilot and not really lose anything. I wouldn't, though; my go-to batch of episodes is Claudia, Burnout, Duped, Age Before Beauty, and Where and When.

I still haven't read past The Lost Hero in the second (scone, fingers???) Percyverse series, so I'm still not sure what I think of the Roman shenanigans. The first series is definitely worth reading, though. LOTUS HOTEL AW HELL NAW.

As for Discworld: I can't stand Rincewind as a central character. I think he's boring. The ones I find most palatable in his arc are the ones where other stuff is going on (and Interesting Times and The Last Continent have their own issues). When I started trying to read the books with The Colour of Magic, I couldn't bring myself to stick around; when I picked up Hogfather, I was hooked.
(And for some reason I can't get my head into the Tiffany Aching books?)
Recommending the Disc gets tricky; I usually ask people what they're interested in, because odds are there's a book for that. My eternal favorites are Soul Music and Moving Pictures, but Quinn likes Maskerade on a much deeper level than I do (she grew up with Broadway the way I grew up with rock and roll).

HARRY POTTER. WHERE DO I START. I did NOT like the last book. Pretty much at all. Unpopular fandom opinion: I think Harry's sacrifice would have been more powerful if he'd stayed dead. I also cannot picture Regulus Doing It All For The House Elf, doubly so when the house elf in question is Kreacher.
And then there's the epilogue. Dear Harry: ALL IS NOT WELL JUST BECAUSE YOU HAVE YOUR HAPPY FAMILY AND YOUR SCAR HASN'T HURT. Ron duping some poor Muggle into giving him a driver's license is proof enough that the wizarding world's status quo hasn't changed (to say nothing of Al's fear of getting sorted into Slytherin), and the scar only ever told him anything about Voldemort. (A theory I want to play with sometime: Hermione could easily go dark on them and they'd never know.)
I do like the world JKR built, though. It's fascinating.

My biggest complaint about Once Upon a Time: Dude, Rumpel, if this is about finding your son, the bounty hunter owes you a favor. Why dump magic into the equation willy-nilly? (Doubly stupid because I think he would've beaten Regina handily in a non-magical fight.)
Red-Handed is possibly my favorite episode so far, for obvious reasons, but it's hard to recommend the show out of order, if only for the sake of the Storybrooke plotline.

*I did notice when I rewatched Where and When the other night that the car they're driving has Wisconsin plates, opening the possibility of 'fly there, rent a car, drive back.' But I think that's pretty unlikely, quite aside from the part where IT WOULD STILL TAKE THIRTEEN HOURS TO DRIVE FROM GREEN BAY TO SOUTH DAKOTA. They're still solving the case when by all rights they should be starting back!
Seriously, if they'd just say what Artifact makes this possible... and then why they didn't use it in the S4 premiere... I'd feel so much better.

I've yet to go beyond The Lost Hero either, I keep meaning to but haven't yet. I think for me it was that feeling of, there are good ideas here but this is an odd twist.

It just felt too much like retconning the other series, which was weird. I mean I love Riordan's mind and he creates great characters, it just left me going huh.

...I think that is exactly my problem with it. I mean, I adore Piper and Leo, and I've heard good things about the Roman campers. But. I think it would have been stronger if the 'oh and also Romans' thing had at least been brought forward as a possibility sometime in the first series.
(Probably Riordan didn't decide he was going to do it until later, but still.)

Yes, that exactly, if it had felt like there was something just beyond, I would have accepted it far easier. Instead the idea of how does this work got in the way of my enjoyment of the series.

He managed to do that with the Kane Chronicles, which I'm also behind on. There are references to the other gods, so you know they're there but not the focus.

When I started trying to read the books with The Colour of Magic, I couldn't bring myself to stick around; when I picked up Hogfather, I was hooked.

Curiously, this is exactly what happened to me, except that what got me was Maskerade (on an indirect Milliways recommendation) instead of Hogfather.

I have not managed to use this method on my sister; for reasons unknown, between the coven beginning of Maskerade and the ten-thousand-year prologue of Going Postal (the two I've tried to start her with) she now tends to rage at the mention of Pratchett's name.

.

Joining in unpopular fandom opinion: I remember buying the last book--I had skipped books five and six, having gotten disillusioned during the wait for OotP--entirely on the basis of "Please let Harry die heroically."

For Half-Life canon, I'd probably leave out Half-Life: Decay. It's a two-player co-op version of the game that only exists on the PS2 port, and it's split screen, and it makes my head ache to try and play.

On the Dragon Age front, I'd avoid mentioning anything about the books or digital comics- not that I have any issues with them, I just haven't read them yet and have no interest in reading the novels. I don't feel that I should have to go to another form of media entirely to understand important background elements in my games or movies. (The digital comics only have my attention because they have Varric in them.)

Mass Effect... ehehe. Step one, I would have people stop playing the game just before Commander Shephard enters the Crucible in London. They don't need to know about the next five minutes. They'll be happier if they never find out about the next five minutes. Step two, I do everything in my power to ignore the existence of Kai Goddamn Villain Stu Leng, because I hate it when a game developer makes me feel like he's waving his Freudian compensation mechanism in my face. Even when his actions are narratively necessary, Kai Goddamn Villain Stu Leng is so aggressively pushed as the most SCARY and BADASS and AWESOME and UNSTOPPABLE thing ever that I wind up rolling my eyes hard enough to see grey matter.

I'm good with The King Must Die canon pretty much as is, although to be honest, if I was going to push it to someone else I would have them read things the same way I did- I started with a copy of The Bull From The Sea by mistake and only later found out The King Must Die existed. Just to see if it had the same effect on them. (Also The Bull From The Sea is much shorter and easier as a first read, plus it uses the names of the gods more often.)

Team Fortress 2 canon... oh hell, I haven't actually played the game since before they introduced hats. I'd just get newbies to sit down and play it with people they actually new in order to show them the awesome.

As for Fallout, I ignore the existence of Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel entirely, and I only use a handful of elements from Fallout Tactics because they appear or are referenced in FO3 and Fallout New Vegas. Also I completely ignore the existence of the fandom because Fallout fans are scary. To get newbie attention I would find out first if they preferred Oblivion-style FPSish rpgs or if they were into old-school top-down isometric RPGs, and depending on the answer either hand them FO3 or FNV (for the Oblivion types) or the first Fallout game (for the old school folks).

I may be back later to mention the TOTALLY AWESOME stuff but I have some work to deal with first.

In all fairness, I think most Fallout fans ignore Brotherhood of Steel. And the WTF Deathclaws were the one thing that genuinely upset me about Tactics.

And Fallout fandom isn't... *totally* insane... just... okay, it's fucking madhouse. Between the gamers and the uh... interesting kink meme my Fallout experience has best been served among close friends since 1998!

Elle - Okay, if you don't know, I hate Heroes, I hate it a lot, and starting at the beginning of season 3 I ignore it more and more until the point where we are now, in which I ignore it entirely. Because I hate it, and my playing Elle is like part meta commentary on how much I hate it. And I would not direct anyone to watch it, not even, at this point, its first season.

Anyway! The thing about this, though, is that once you hit this level of hatred, every problem with any other canon feels not-so-bad by comparison! So that's nice.

Asami - I have some issues with Korra, but they're not that serious, and most of them are things I'd actually like to develop rather than ignore. There were issues with the pacing, and the way Mako and Asami's relationship was handled was rather... blah, but those are things the Bar can help with, and not in a way that requires me writing some multi-year AU arc for anyone.

As for how I'd introduce people to it - well, I'd probably go with showing them Avatar: The Last Airbender first, and if they're the type of person who's going to be put off by watching a cartoon (especially as it took a bit for A:TLA to find its feet in its first season), my favorite episode to use, provided they don't mind spoilers, is "City of Walls and Secrets," as it's generally my favorite episode of A:TLA, and give a sense of the more complex themes on the show. If I felt like I should start with Korra, but for whatever reason not just the first episode, I guess I'd go with "The Revelation."

Leslie - Parks and Rec isn't perfect, but it's probably the canon I have the least problems with, and there's nothing I ignore. When people are just starting out, however, I do usually recommend they skip the first season and start straight with the second. I don't ignore season 1, but it is definitely pretty subpar compared to the rest of the series, a lot because it seems like they hadn't fully decided what they were doing with Leslie's character. And as I personally had watched season 1 when it was airing and was unimpressed and didn't come around to try to watch it again until near the end of season 2, and as there's nothing you really miss if you don't see season 1, I'd generally recommend just skipping it and maybe going back to watch it after having seen the rest of the series.

Manny - There's nothing I ignore. And as it's a PC game, there's not much to do in terms of introducing people to it except to... try to force the computer running it into their hands at random times and being like "PLAY THIS NOW!!!" It also doesn't help that LucasArts discontinued production ages ago so it's hard to get a legit copy. I think the part I describe the most when trying to sell people on Grim Fandango is Year 2, because I do think it's the most beautiful visually, and I love the Casablanca homage.

Edited 2012-09-19 15:28 (UTC)

There is a full playthrough of Grim Fandango on Youtube. It's not as good as playing the game, but it can show it off.

So far, there's been only one part of the canon that I've been avoiding. Mark uses the phrase, "This is so gay." several times in the early part of his canon, usually when dealing with his best friend William asking him to take him flying. In Invincible, Kirkman makes a point of showing that there are really only two ways for a flying hero to transport a non-flying person, either by cradling them in their arms or by "pitting" - carrying them under their armpits - which is noted by a number of non-flyers as being uncomfortable. Mark evidently has no problems carrying his girlfriend in a cradle position, but when his best friend asks him to do it, we get a shot of him muttering, "This is so gay." (Eve does it as well, when William asks her to fly him at one point.)

I don't think Kirkman meant to be offensive with the joke, and he dropped the routine after a couple of times. (Except for the fact that William comes out of the closet around issue #75, which sort of comes out of left field.) However, it is kind of offensive, whether he intended it to be or not. So I dropped it.

Fantastic Four is my default comic canon. I grew up with them. Best runs in my opinion are John Burne's, the Wade/Wieringo and Jonathan Hickman's. I would also highly recommend Marvel Knights 4 and the FF or Future Foundation series.

As to what I ignore, for Ben I'm really trying my best to keep away from cross-overs, especially the current Avengers vs X-Men. For Val, I'm ignoring Franklin using his powers to reset Val into being a fetus in his mommy and have decided it was the Ultimate Nullifier reseting as Franklin doing it is just creepy and wrong. Thank you Jeff Loeb. I would still love to know what Chris Clairemont's original ideas were for Val though.

With Jessica Drew I'm sort of ignoring her first series as I like the idea of her father working for HYDRA. Other continuity errors I am passing off as her faulty memory from brainwashing. I can not advise Spider-Woman: Agent of SWORD enough (super spy vs alien action with great art) and I enjoyed Spider-Woman: Origin as well. Her original series is fun but very dated and I'm mostly ignoring what's happening in Avengers and definitely her romance with Clint as it doesn't feel right to me.

I'm not ignoring much with Thalia Grace though I am toning down the hinted romance with Luke as she would have been too young to really fall for him, IMHO. I also plan on giving her more Zeus abilities than just lightening as it bugged me how a certain son of Jupiter got more powers. Best books for her would be Titan's Curse and Last Olympian. It does bug me that she still has her acrophobia in Lost Hero as in my head canon she faces it by making peace with Zeus. Also if you can get your hands on The Demigod Files, read Sword of Hades for a fun Percy, Nico and Thalia story which likely happens between Battle for the Labyrinth and Last Olympian.

Kate Kane's greatest hits are her present series, Batwoman, and Rucka's run on Detective Comics (854-863). I wouldn't advise 52, Final Crisis or Books of Blood unless you know your DC canon. About the only thing I am having trouble ignoring at this point is the NuDCU and whether Renee was/is The Question (which is seeming unlikely) or that anything outside of Detective Comics happened in her past.

And that's enough for me right now.

Edited 2012-09-19 18:21 (UTC)

Boyd Crowder (

fireinthehole) canonically spends about twenty years entrenched in white supremacist/militia movements/hate groups/things that get you on the Southern Poverty Law Center's watch list. At the point in canon that I've brought him in from (early s2), he's pretty well separated from all of it, but habits die hard, and tattoos don't disappear without a lot of money and a lot of lasers. (And we see him keep them through s3.)

There is a line to walk: I don't want to pretend this just wasn't a part of Boyd's past, because it was, and I am personally and professionally opposed to willful ignorance. These movements hurt people, they threaten (and end) people's lives on the regular, and there is a long and nasty history of these movements in the United States that is deeply relevant to contemporary life. So I can't ignore it, which means it'll have to be portrayed in the game in some way, if not necessarily in the words I put in Boyd's mouth.

And yet this is supposed to be pretendy funtime games. I don't have the time or the mental wherewithal to do deep-level research into white supremacist ideologies (or at least not more than I have to do in my day-to-day life for my research), and I can't help but feel that the people I play with don't deserve to have hateful rhetoric dropped on them in their pretendy funtime games. I don't really want to write it, and I'm assuming y'all don't want to see it.

So if Boyd Crowder comes across as a little kinder and gentler in the bar than he does on Justified, and if you think that's OOC, that's probably because it is. However, I believe firmly that it is better than the alternative. If you disagree, that doesn't hurt my feelings.

Also, I got hooked on Justified less than thirty seconds into the pilot, so that'd be it. If impending throwdowns with guns don't hook you like they do me, though... probably the one where W. Earl Brown plays a fugitive with a gun to a cop's head and Raylan has to talk him down by means of some hot chicken and whiskey.

Heh. Heheheh.

Kirk's got Star Trek V. I kind of papered over that one in my millicanon.

Knox has...well, pretty much everything after the Batman film he's actually in. If I had the time, I would have rewritten a lot of Batman Returns and I am still working on a totally radical approach to Batman For(no reason whatso)ever that adds a Robin but nothing else.

Gibbs has PotC4. Sorry, but it's just not that good. Even if it has a lot of Gibbs.

Futurama
Avoid: Each season has its share of mediocre episodes, but the only thing I actively ignore is the second movie. Negative continuity and character development, squicky plot that barely hangs together.... no. Just... no.

Recommend: .. Kind of a lot, actually. I 've been meaning to put together a list for a while. In terms of Fry's story, "Roswell That Ends Well", "The Luck of the Fryrish", "The Why of Fry" and "Cold Warriors" are probably the main ones to hit. (Along with "Jurassic Bark," but bring a tissue because it makes EVERYONE cry. >.>) The anthology episodes are also pretty fun, but probably less interesting if you're new to the show.

Psych
Avoid: Nothing stands out as especially terrible, but I tend to ignore a pretty large chunk of season 1. (Which is okay because the writers do too. :P)

Recommend: again, there's quite a few, but the Yin/Yang trilogy is an awesome example of just what the show's capable of. (Though they do get a bit more dramatic than the show usually tends to be.)

The Adventures of Brisco County Jr.
Avoid: Nothing. Even the clunky episodes still tend to be pretty fun. (Pirates in the wild west, anyone?)

Recommend: All of it, but I have a special place in my heart for the season/series finale. They managed to wrap up a major story arc over the course of one season and give the show a very satisfying send-off, which is especially impressive since they didn't find out they were being cancelled until very late that summer.

Edited 2012-09-19 17:02 (UTC)

In terms of Psych there are a couple episodes I tend to sort of gloss over... but each season has a few really strong standouts for each character.

I just don't think about the physics of Jack's canon. It makes things so much easier.
Otherwise, start at the beginning of the books.

Erik is an original character for the movie canon. Which film in the continuity I would initially recommend, probably depends upon what people like.

And for Alfred, I'd recommend watching the films in order, though watching The Dark Knight before Batman Begins is a perfectly viable option.

I am all for showing the AWESOME because my canons are awesome.

Kirby: I'll start with the music. Beyond that, well... The series is cute, but the game developers aren't afraid to bust out some gruesome stuff, too. It's also got something for everyone. If you're not that experienced with video games, Kirby's a good way to get your foot in the door. If you are experienced with video games, believe you me Kirby's got more than a few challenges up its sleeve. If I had to pick specific games for people to check out... Kirby's Epic Yarn (Wii) for the CUTE, Kirby Mass Attack (DS) for the CUTE (and also to let you know that HAL gets really creative with the game mechanics of this series), Kirby's Return to Dream Land (Wii) for a good introduction on the basics of traditional Kirby gameplay, and Kirby Super Star Ultra (DS) for a solid traditional Kirby platformer that shows you just how incredibly difficult this series can get.

Link and Zelda: ...I'll start with the music. As for the game: while it'll require you to buy an extra accessory for the Wii Remote (Wii Motion Plus) and isn't kind to people whose bodies aren't ready for motion sensitivity, it is a fun game with an excellent storyline. I feel the motion controls do a great job immersing you into the game, so that Link isn't just some character you're controlling with buttons, but someone whose life depends on your actual dexterity with your hands. Also: KITTIES.

Pit and/or Viridi from Kid Icarus: Uprising: This is getting redundant (keep in mind this is for a handheld game). As for what I'd show as a demonstration of awesome? I'll let the game speak for itself.

Edited 2012-09-19 17:29 (UTC)

A handheld game, you say?

How about a one-speaker handheld game?

(I really ought to send Felix at one of yours, one of these days.)

Thor/Avengers/etc

Ignore: Mostly I love all this canon (although I haven't gotten around to inflicting Iron Man 2 on myself yet) and am good with it, but there are two small details I am quietly papering over. 1) It's explicitly canon that Loki was an infant in 975 AD, which is when the big war with Jotunheim happened. Extrapolating from that means that unless Asgardians and Jotuns grow at a human pace as children (which... why would they?), Loki and probably Thor couldn't possibly have been old enough to inspire legends until, oh, around about the era when Christianity was solidly settling in. So I am discreetly kicking that year back a few centuries, so they can at least be preteens and teenagers during the Viking era. 2) I won't get to Avengers for a while yet, but: "He's adopted." *facepalming* Yes, it's snappy and the comic timing is great, but -- there are people who could say that line then, and there are times when Thor could say that line, but right then is neither. It flies in the face of all the rest of the Thor-Loki interactions in the movie.

Recommend: Well, they're movies, so they're not too long! But I have been known to link people to the diner scene and the pet store scene on YouTube.

Firefly

Ignore: We've shoehorned in a lot of worldbuilding, both societal and in terms of spaceship travel. Also, Millicanon has Asian people.

Recommend: Depends on what they're into! There are a lot of strong episodes.

Gundam Wing

Ignore: ...Ahahahahahahahaha.

Uh. There's that whole part where Quatre claims that Heero is the heart of outer space... Blood loss and we're sticking to it, is I think the general munly consensus there. But in general we don't so much ignore any of canon as try desperately to fill in all the holes with stuff that makes sense.

Oh, I think we're pretty solidly ignoring the flamethrowers in outer space, also. Right?

Recommend: uhhh. Probably not the first episode! Most of the protagonists don't show up until the second, and they recap the set-up at the start of the first several episodes anyway. In general I would give an allcaps-laden summary of the show and why it's both awesome and terrible, and see what parts amused them most out of that summary.

I'm pretty sure I've shown people the part where Trowa and Quatre meet on a battlefield, simultaneously surrender, and then retire to have a violin-and-flute duet surrounded by sparkles (all of this well before exchanging names), but that's not really representative of canon as a whole. Just hilarious.

Claymore

Ignore: I feel like there are things I do wave away that I'm not thinking of... A lot of what doesn't make sense in early canon is complicated later, but some of it's still very handwavy. (Most notably, laws of physics.) Some of the skeevier subtext I opt to ignore, I guess.

Recommend: oh man. I guess I'd probably show them some of the anime, just because that's quicker and more eye-catching than a giant manga series? I dunno, though. Anyway, I'd probably just start at the beginning, or at the most go to one of the slightly later arcs (the Teresa backstory, probably) and skip back to the beginning afterwards.

Edited 2012-09-19 19:44 (UTC)

I'd use one of the flashes to convince people of Homestuck's awesomeness. Something from Act 3 or 4 so they don't get too badly spoilered. I think Rose's [S] Enter page would do the job nicely; it's fairly exciting even if you don't know the significance of anything the characters are doing, and it doesn't give away any big plot twists.

Act 1 is really boring compared to the rest of the comic (I liked it, but I totally understand if other people don't); I wouldn't recommend skipping it completely but it makes a lousy introduction. I was told that it works better as a transition from Problem Sleuth, and given the comparatively sedate (and meandering) pacing and tone of Problem Sleuth I'll believe that. But Act 1 doesn't really work outside that context.

Edited 2012-09-19 20:33 (UTC)

Well.

There is nothing I do not love about The Chronicles of Narnia. They're a fast, fun read with a story that appeals to generations of people, and may be read as critically or as casually as one wishes. Generally speaking, I suggest LWW or Dawn Treader as a starting point for newcomers to the canon.

However, I will have to disagree with Fi up there about the movies: while I enjoy The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe, I would advise against seeing Disney's Prince Caspian, and not only because they, in a show of shockingly poor decision-making, failed to cast Jeremy Sumpter. The movie of PC takes away much of the important pieces of the original story, by aging Caspian, shoe-horning in a love story, and dismissing some key elements in favor of a castle raid and vengeance storyline that doesn't exist in the book.

On the other hand, Voyage of the Dawn Treader got so much right that I think they must have actively tried to get the wrong stuff wrong. And it is.

For anyone new to Once Upon a Time, I tell them to watch through Episode 7. Yes, it can be cheesy. Yes, the special effects are not always great. However, the writing is fantastic, the stories compelling, and the characters flawed and interesting. Emma pisses me off more than once, but there are reasons behind her actions and reactions.

Hawaii Five-0 snagged me two minutes into the pilot and hasn't let go since. It's honestly one of the strongest pilot episodes I've seen, but if I were forced to pick another to showcase the things I love, it would probably be 1.03 "Malama Ka ʻAina" or 1.08 "Manaʻo", both of which highlight the relationships between the characters and have some really fantastic lines.

Danny, personally, has a few of his greatest hits in his profile, and I would strongly suggest watching them.

Brokeback Mountain is a gorgeous movie and a tightly written, heart-breakingly lovely short story. Everyone should see the one and read the other.

Wolfwood doesn't show up in Trigun until nearly halfway through, but his episodes are some of the best in the show. "Paradise" is easily his greatest episode, but Trigun is full of fantastic moments.

Edited 2012-09-19 20:30 (UTC)

Ah, true, I loved the first movie, wasn't a big fan of Caspian and never saw Dawn Treader. I should have just said first movie instead of movies.

Only going to respond regarding one of my pups, because it's the one that's easiest to answer:

Doctor Who
Ignore: The TV movie. Especially "I'm half human. On my mother's side."

Recommend: When I want to get people into DW, I show them Blink first. Which is ironic since the Doctor's barely in it at all. But that episode has never failed to hook people in.

Oh, "Rescue Me." Why are you so problematic sometimes. I would cite the rampant homophobic jokes as the prime example, although to the writer's credit, slim though it is, they do make up for it as they go along. You just have to stick around long enough for it to happen, if that sort of shit hasn't turned you off the show to begin with.

As for the awesome...

A game of Scrabble.

LOU NEEDS AVOCADOS! MEXICAN NIGHT IS IN PERIL! CROUCHING TIGER HIDDEN HOCKEY PLAYER!

FIRE AND SINATRA. Possibly THE BEST musical montage that has ever been on the show.

No sex with nuns in the place where I live. A Tommy and Lou moment. This will never not be hilarious to me.

This also is why I love Lou.

Fanvid using "Run" by Snow Patrol

Henry: It has its problems. I can't lay a finger on one off the top of my head (I need a refresh). Emma pisses me off sometimes, and August can get me pretty cheesed off (no, don't question my turn of phrase). But I definitely loved it from episode one, mostly 'cos Henry hit me with all the d'aww feelings, so I'd start there. Also it just explains the stage of the whole tale so well.

Lois: I ignore every time the Smallville writers fail to English properly. And it happens. I also try really hard to pretend canon didn't happen, frequently. Even though I still play through it. I despise Lana, and not just in the knee-jerk Team Lane way (I'm sure I'm biased there, though). Kreuk did a fine job, but the producers were obviously having a fetish for her, and whenever she was an Object Of Lust for them, Lex, Clark, or anyone else and not just being a strong character? She was incredibly unlikable. Also, the way she treated Clark is frankly disgusting, and I despise that the writing somehow makes her out to be The Tragic Heroine All Should Adore. Comics!Lana is not like that, so I'm really disappointed they didn't manage it. Also sad they failed to handle Miss Chloe New Character Sullivan in a way which satisfied me. (I blame her for Doomsday and Jimmy, okay.)

Honestly, the pilot's where I would start anyone, although I'd immediately jump straight from there to 2x17 with Chris Reeve in and then to season 4. That's me, though.

Tavi: I swear to god I am going to OOM the Captain's Fury Grey Tower assault to be less strategically fail. You do NOT have the escortee go up last, okay. I am also displeased with the holes in the worldbuilding, culture and history beyond "last generation" and sketchy "centuries ago" primarily. Other than that, I... somehow doubt you could just start with book three, but it's the first book I would say "No Really You Will Like It It Is The Awesome." I adore the first two, but still, Cursor's is... stellar. Frankly, though, for what I show to people to get them into Alera? Generally either my post on furycrafting or five words: "Lost Roman Legion with Pokemon." For some reason the latter always gets somewhere.

Reno: one of the most variable canons I play from, as it should be with improvisational shows.

Watch: Reno911: Miami, Not Without My Mustache, Clementine and Garcia are Dating, Clemmy Thinks She's Pregnant, Christian Singles Mixer, Super Knockers! and Clemmy Marries a Dead Guy all good, most with the genesis of Clemmy's personality.

Avoid: Season 5? What season 5? It never happened! CLEMENTINE ISN'T SPOILER. GARCIA ISN'T SPOILER. THERE ARE NO DETECTIVE SPOILERS.

Brisco is perfect. Perfect show is positively perfect and the whole canon is a true adventure.

Watch: The whole series, all the way through. NO EXCEPTIONS.

Avoid: if you have to, Fountain of Youth is the weakest of the pack.

Psych: Is pretty fairly good overall!

Watch: Dead Bear Walking, Extradition Parts 1 and 2, Let's Doo Wop It and Let's Doo Wop It Again, This Episode Sucks, You Can't Handle This Episode, A Very Juliet Episode, Lights Cameras Homicido, Tuesday the 17th, Mr. Yin Presents, Spellingg Bee, Shawn Vs The Red Phantom, American Duos, Gus Walks Into a Bank.

Avoid: Good chunks of S1 feature overly!obnoxious!Shawn. Outside of "Spellingg Bee", "Shawn Vs The Red Phantom" and "9 Lives". So avoid it 'til you get to the season finale, Scary Sherri. Season 2 is mostly good, but Season 3's "Ghosts" is really where the show comes alive and Shawn starts to be softened.

My Little Pony: FIM: Excellent, funny, well-done overall.

Watch: Sisterhooves Social, Both season finale episodes, Baby Cakes, Griffon the Brush Off, a Friend In Deed, Ponyville Confidential, The Cutie Mark Chronicles, Read it and Weep.

Avoid: I can't think of much TO avoid.

Edited 2012-09-20 06:46 (UTC)

Good chunks of S1 feature overly!obnoxious!Shawn.

Oh geez, I could write PAGES about Shawn's character development. But yes, "Ghosts" was a huuuge turning point. (And the ending makes me sniffle every time. Dammit. -_-) Although it's odd that you mention overly obnoxious Shawn, because he's pretty insufferable for a lot of that episode too. (For fairly sympathetic reasons, but still.)

I second the rec for "Shawn Vs The Red Phantom," solely based on George Takei's guest spot. I'd say this is the ep that suffered the most from the retconning of characterization in the later seasons. :/

Edited 2012-09-20 06:53 (UTC)

I think the big problem with S1 is that Shawn's such a Karma Houdini throughout most of it, without the sweetness that makes him so likable by the middle of canon. S3 starts to round him out, show us his flaws and make him human, so that by the time we get to S5 and he's dealing with SPOILER, we feel for him.

I think I picked it because it explains WHY he's been such a brat, the chip on his shoulder, etc.

That is true and an excellent point.

Shawn has this ability to be obnoxious and adorable at the same time, and it shows up a lot in season 2. It's sort of endearing and infuriating by turns. By season 3, a lot of his rough edges are a little.smoother, and his friendship with Gus is on a more equal footing.

overall I think the end of season 2 and the beginning of season 3 is where the show really starts to shine.

Edited 2012-09-20 08:02 (UTC)

*NODS!* I think even by season 2 they realize he's getting away with too much and Lassiter and Gus are suffering disproportionately. And hee this <3

they specifically mention trying to give Gus a more equal role in season 2, so they were definitely aware of it.

OH. I'd also recommend "From Earth to the Starbucks" from S1. First, because it's hilarious, and second, because you actually get to see Shawn doing acts of kindness for other people.

*NODS* you can see them correcting it, all the way up through the secret marriage and daredevil episodes, giving Gus more of a background and Stuff to Do when Shawn's not around.

THE ALIENS EPISODE YES <3

The planetarium one. The speed dating ep is the one where aliens were supposedly involved. (And it's another one that suffers in the retconning. SHAWN, DO YOU BELIEVE IN UFOS OR NOT? :P)

*POKES HIM*

(My guess is that he does, but he's kind of afraid to?)

My issue with it is that they wrote it as something he was REALLY INTO since childhood, which really doesn't fit the generally-skeptical-of-the-supernatural way they wrote him prior to that episode. I miss that, because a skeptic pretending to be psychic adds a whole new layer of comedy.

It's the same with the Comic-Con ep. They have him scoffing at Gus's geekdom, but in a later flashback he goes to a con WITH HIM.... IT ANNOYS ME TO A PROBABLY DISPROPORTIONATE DEGREE. :P

Edited 2012-09-20 08:44 (UTC)

...I can totally envision that. BB!Shawn believed Darth Vadar was real, BB!Shawn believed in aliens, so adult!Shawn tries to scoff it away.

SHAWN YOU USED TO DRESS UP AS THE GUY FROM TEARS FOR FEARS, YOUR COSPLAY CRED IS ASSURED FOREVER.

I have to admit... I didn't like Spellingg Bee. I know it's kinda weird since it's the first episode where Gus' character framework building starts but the episode itself bothers me - the whole thought that Shawn would be so needy as a teenager to sabotage Gus' dreams really bothers me. And then Henry & Shawn stuff feels really harsh, even for early Henry & Shawn. IDK.

And for what it's worth, I really thought overly!obnoxious!Shawn was great in season 1 episodes like "Weekend Warriors" (which is worth watching for the precious few seconds of Corbin shirtless & Lassie in Civil War garb) and "Forget Me Not" had quite possibly one of the most touching moments until season 3. :p

I think the obnoxiousness works in context, if you think of it as him just coming back from having spent so long on the road. I just started to like him more as a character in season 2 and 3.

And yeah, Spellingg Bee has its issues, but the Shawn/Jules meeting is still one of my favorite scenes in the whole series.

Edited 2012-09-26 17:41 (UTC)

Well, Shawn IS a big ol' pile of needy neediness, so I don't find that too terribly shocking.

Weekend Warriors is lovely tho.

Jim is from Blazing Saddles, which you should totally watch if you haven't already. The same applies to McCabe & Mrs. Miller and Borgel, which are a subversive and powerful anti-Western film directed by Robert Altman and a delightful young adult-oriented sci-fi comedy book by Daniel Pinkwater, respectively.

Doctor Who has 32 1/2 seasons worth of canon to work through - and that's if you exclude the books, comics, audio dramas, and the Jon Pertwee recipe book. "Where should I start?" is a difficult question to answer even for fans. If I have to choose someplace, I echo the advice of the good Doctor's mun - start with "Blink," then loop back to "Rose," the first episode of the revived series, and continue from there.

If we're sticking exclusively to televised serials in which Leela herself appears, there's a lot of good stuff packed into that season and a half. The Talons of Weng-Chiang is well-written, fun, and (uncharacteristically for 70s Doctor Who) looks fantastic. Unfortunately, it also features a Fu Manchu type character played by a white man in yellowface. But it's great if you can get past that one admittedly glaring flaw. Less problematic are The Horror of Fang Rock (a great story set in a lighthouse which (IMO) features Leela at her best), and The Robots of Death (which is basically like an Agatha Christie story. On a futuristic mining crawler. With robots).

So yeah, watch those ones. Avoid Underworld and The Invisible Enemy. In addition to being terrible stories, they also infuriate me by getting Leela's character completely wrong.

As for Kane...well, as far as I'm concerned, C&C 4 never happened. It does not exist - it is at most a rumor, or perhaps a practical joke. When I get past Kane's Wrath in his canon, I'll just have to come up with something on my own, since the fourth game of the Tiberium series remains unmade. The first C&C game is a classic, but I doubt it's aged well. Tiberian Sun is the best game in the C&C series, in my opinion, though C&C 3 (particularly its expansion, Kane's Wrath) is also a worthy entry in the series. Either one of those would be good places to start.

Atrus's canon experiences a sharp dip in quality as the series progresses. The first Myst game changed adventure games forever, and the second game in the series, Riven, is a classic. Riven is fiendishly, maddeningly difficult, but it's also set in an immersive, well-thought-out world. Heck, the puzzles even make sense when you think about them! The third game, Exile, is also worth playing (and it has Wormtongue in it!). I'd recommend you play those three in order.

After that, the Myst series gets bogged down in dippy mysticism and moon logic. The puzzles aren't as good and the story isn't as interesting. The fourth game also introduces certain ideas about prison books (which are a major plot point in the first two games) which I don't really like and may or may not quasi-retcon in Millicanon (but then again I might not).

Edited 2012-09-20 08:17 (UTC)

DE: I'll show you mine if you show me yours

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Shh. I'm asleep. >.>

SURE YOU ARE REBECCA ;)

I AM, SHUT UP.

I BELIEVE

I'M SLEEPTYPING. IT'S A THING.

TYPING WITH YOUR MIND IS THE NEW FRONTIER

BOLDLY GOING WHERE NO INSOMNIAC HAS GONE BEFORE

And I'm ironically headed to bed!

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